ATF being sued over approving legal machine guns

[NWSharpshooter]

Trusts are already on thin ice. If the sheeples media learns about the class III world and figures out how trusts work, they would have a hay-day. If a sheep learns that a non background checked trustee could have access to NFA items, they would **** a brick. If a sheep learns that trusts are looking to build their own new MGs, they would **** two bricks. When the sheeples media reported on that instructor that got shot by the girl with the micro, they said that machineguns are very expensive and require extensive paper work and approval. Those words were comforting to the sheep. However, if a sheep learns that people are looking to change a law to allow trusts to build MGs for as little as a $5 lightning link or sear, they will **** three bricks. Now on to the economics. Its obvious that if the law passed, transferable pre 86 MGs would drop in value 1000%. Literally 1000%. With that being the case, I would not doubt for a second that people like Ruben Mendiola would personally drop 6 figures fighting the proposed law. 50K is chump change for the machinegun dealers out there. There are alot of MG dealers out there that make a good living flipping machineguns. I wouldn't doubt that they could raise 1+ million $ in a week, if they felt the proposed law change threatened their career & livelyhood. Their are also a ton of people/collectors that personally have 1+ million in MG investments. They would join the dealers and protect their investment as well. Personally, I "only" have about 80k in machineguns. I only do cleo sign off to ensure protection of my investments. I will not risk a ship ton of my money on whatever the future has to bring for trusts. Especially now, where the trusts are already on thin ice, these lawsuits just bring a hot summer day to them. I however, am for being able to build new MGs. If the law was changed, I would store my cleo signed off items in a safe and start up a trust. I would build a **** ton of new MGs and enjoy them before trusts as a whole are ****-canned.

Just my 2cents

Machine gun dealers may secretly oppose the reclaiming of our rights and freedoms, but you would be hard pressed to find one to openly admit it, much less fund a fight against it. They will still make a living even if this is successful, if not in transferable machine guns, then elsewhere. However, if word got out that one of them was actively fighting against the rights of gun owners, they would be done in the gun industry. Counter clerk at Dicks Sporting goods is about as good as it will get for them as no serious gun owner would ever do business with them again.

 

[TheSnail]

Machine gun dealers may secretly oppose the reclaiming of our rights and freedoms, but you would be hard pressed to find one to openly admit it, much less fund a fight against it. They will still make a living even if this is successful, if not in transferable machine guns, then elsewhere. However, if word got out that one of them was actively fighting against the rights of gun owners, they would be done in the gun industry. Counter clerk at Dicks Sporting goods is about as good as it will get for them as no serious gun owner would ever do business with them again.

I absolutely agree. Dicks is a good example. They pulled the AR15s that they just started caring off the shelf a week or two after Sandyhook. They did Troy dirty by turning their backs on their new short lived relationship. My business with Dicks, left with Troy and the evil black rifles.

 

[jcountry]

I am going to try to be as polite as I can here in the hopes that you grab a clue and move on. You have been negative about this for a few pages now. Every nonsensical, pointless and down right stupid reason for your negativity has been shot down time and time again. Yet here you are still thumping your chest how this is some sort of scam. You have jumped, skipped and hopped from reason to reason why this wont work. It is clear that you do not understand the details of this case. You have no understanding of how the NFA process works. If you did you wouldn't be in this thread saying dumb things like how the ATF will just change their interpretation on trust's or raise the "fee". First it is not a fee. It is a tax. They don't get to just change this tax as they see fit. When this tax was first introduced it was very prohibitive in 1934 dollars. Even in today's dollars a $200 is prohibitive to some. For this reason alone there is a legal argument to be made that the NFA act unconstitutionally blocks a citizen from exercising their right to the 2nd Amendment. Going to court on something like that would be a very bad thing for the ATF. I am not even going to get started on your even dumber "Obama executive orders" bull****, I will just keep it simple. You don't understand how executive orders work either.

Finally we come to the scam nonsense you keep ranting about. This suite already made headlines. $50K is not a bad starting point for a case like this and you have to craw before you can walk or run. Right now it is a matter of filing things like FOIA requests to find out if the NFA system has been abused for political gain among other things. Right now it is all about moving your pieces into position. That is what this money push is for right now. Will it cost more than $50K? You bet but you have to start the fire first in order to get the people out to watch it burn. Once people start hearing more and more about this it will continue to move forward with a lot of momentum. We have the numbers all we have to do is be willing to fight against government encroachment. You don't want to fight? That is alright, you have made that clear over and over again in this thread. People far better than you or I will fight on your behalf. You can go back to burying your head in the sand with the other naysayers. Ignorance is bliss I guess.

BTW currently at $27,245 in 4 days.

Once again... (I know I am gonna have as much success as I would trying to convince a stump.) You have a very basic misunderstanding of what the ATF does. And a very basic misunderstanding of what a right is (as it is interpreted by the court.)
The supreme court has showed time and again that they don't think the 2nd is limitless. They depend on congress and the ATF to restrict what people can own and how they can own it. The whole NFA is more of an administrative process than anything else. Just like all the hoops liquor manufacturers have to jump through to make and sell their product.

The ATF is an administrative agency. What this suit attempts to attack are administrative interpretations (like trusts and the $200 tax.) I see nothing in this lawsuit which will do anything more than make them change an interpretation or two. (And we tend to forget that some interpretations will be likely to get worse.) I think it is extremely unlikely that this suit will have any kind of positive effect of the NFA or the ban. (Won't hurt some attorney's bank accounts, though.)

Go ahead and contribute whatever you want. You will have yourself to blame when trusts are outlawed. (And they will be-just because of this kind of silly crap.)

Maybe I am wrong. Maybe the ban will be lifted and the whole NFA will get thrown out as unconstitutional. Put your money in this thing. Put it all in. Take out a 2nd mortgage if I am so wrong and stupid. Let it ride!

(I expect to see the fund jump by at least 10K today-since I am so stupid, and you are so convinced it will work.) And when the NFA gets tossed, and the 86 ban gets thrown out-you can come and say "look, I was right-stupid!"

-Just don't forget to express your confidence with big money! Sell that jet ski, cash in the college fund! Get her done-and enjoy the deep satisfaction of knowing that your are right-and I am completely full of ****!

Just be sure and remember who was "stupid" when all the dust settles.

 

[GlockIssue]

In to read through later.

 

[No2sc2]

The law states that a MG can only be made if government grants permission right? So would it be legal if a LE agency form 1 a MG then turns around and sell it for mad profit to a FFL dealer as a "trade in" and grants permission to transfer it. Would it be legal?

 

[Aimless]

Once again... (I know I am gonna have as much success as I would trying to convince a stump.) You have a very basic misunderstanding of what the ATF does. And a very basic misunderstanding of what a right is (as it is interpreted by the court.)
The supreme court has showed time and again that they don't think the 2nd is limitless. They depend on congress and the ATF to restrict what people can own and how they can own it. The whole NFA is more of an administrative process than anything else. Just like all the hoops liquor manufacturers have to jump through to make and sell their product.

The ATF is an administrative agency. What this suit attempts to attack are administrative interpretations (like trusts and the $200 tax.) I see nothing in this lawsuit which will do anything more than make them change an interpretation or two. (And we tend to forget that some interpretations will be likely to get worse.) I think it is extremely unlikely that this suit will have any kind of positive effect of the NFA or the ban. (Won't hurt some attorney's bank accounts, though.)

Go ahead and contribute whatever you want. You will have yourself to blame when trusts are outlawed. (And they will be-just because of this kind of silly crap.)

Maybe I am wrong. Maybe the ban will be lifted and the whole NFA will get thrown out as unconstitutional. Put your money in this thing. Put it all in. Take out a 2nd mortgage if I am so wrong and stupid. Let it ride!

(I expect to see the fund jump by at least 10K today-since I am so stupid, and you are so convinced it will work.) And when the NFA gets tossed, and the 86 ban gets thrown out-you can come and say "look, I was right-stupid!"

-Just don't forget to express your confidence with big money! Sell that jet ski, cash in the college fund! Get her done-and enjoy the deep satisfaction of knowing that your are right-and I am completely full of ****!

Just be sure and remember who was "stupid" when all the dust settles.

Lol. You know, I really use to think someone else was the absolute most ignorant member we had here but this little rant of yours just eclipsed the dumb things he has left fly by a mile. I am not going to nitpick and tear through that nonsense.

So I will just say this; Jcountry, thanks for your concern over my financial planning and well being. Not to be that guy, but spending a few hundred on this or even a few thousand down the road is not going to bankrupt me. No jet ski will be sold, or college tuition will be lost and I will still have my health care intact no matter how much it increases. When the dust settles win lose or draw I will not feel stupid over this because I know at the end of the day others and I at least attempted to change the course of this system of government we have. You on the other hand will still be a guy on a website, completely full of ****. Ranting and raving only convincing yourself and a very small, very select group of people that subscribe to that sort of special stupid, that you have even the slightest idea what it is you are talking about.

 

[Aimless]

Passed $28K. http://www.gofundme.com/fmxlnk

 

[Hayata]

I'm surprised the ammo manufacturer's aren't super-funding this project.

THEY have the most to gain from it.

 

[righter13]

I'm surprised the ammo manufacturer's aren't super-funding this project.

THEY have the most to gain from it.

That's true... Didn't think about that aspect.

 

[No2sc2]

I'm surprised the ammo manufacturer's aren't super-funding this project.

THEY have the most to gain from it.

As much gain as a persons wallet. They benefit either way.